In this episode we interview with Debbie Lacy. Debbie is the founder of Eastside for All, which serves communities outside of Seattle, WA including Bellevue, Kirkland, Redmond, Issaquah and Sammamish. Eastside for All has a mission to transform East King County into a place where racial, economic and social justice are realized, and belonging is made possible for communities of color. Debbie shares about her Build for Belonging Initiative and specifically her use of the co-creation framework as she advocates to build a cross-cultural center with belonging in mind.
This episode of Who Belongs? is part of a new series of podcasts focused on telling bridging stories. Throughout the series we’ll talk to leaders implementing bridging work and individuals who have experienced the bridging transformation. This project is led by OBI’s Blueprint for Belonging project (B4B), and hosted by program researcher Miriam Magaña Lopez. This project is funded by The Annie E. Casey Foundation, Inc.
Transcript
Debbie Lacy:
Future generations will benefit from a new way of relating to each other, to people who are different from them, and relating to their own physical built spaces around them, the earth. We owe it to them to build this now where we can and how we can.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Welcome to today's episode of a new sub series of the podcast Who Belongs? The Othering & Belonging Institute, with financial support from the Annie E. Casey Foundation is developing a series of podcast to capture examples of bridging to belonging.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
We want to a world where everyone belongs, so how do we get there? The answer, bridging. Throughout the series, we will talk to leaders implementing bridging work and individuals who have experienced a bridging transformation. My name is Miriam Magaña Lopez, and I will be hosting today's episode.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Today, we will be speaking with Debbie Lacy. Debbie is the founder of Eastside For All which serves Eastern King County, Eastern King County encompasses a few cities outside of Seattle, Washington. Eastside For All, has a mission to transform East King County into a place where racial, economic and social justice are realized, and belonging is made possible for communities of color.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Today, Debbie will talk to us about her Build for Belonging Initiative and specifically her use of the co-creation framework as she advocates to build a cross-cultural center with belonging in mind.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
To begin, can you give us a brief background of East King County and the communities that lives there?Debbie Lacy:
Yes. What we currently know of as East King County in the Eastern suburbs of Seattle is on the unseated and ancestral land of the Coast Salish, the Duwamish, Nokomis, Stillaguamish, and the Suquamish people. And then settler colonialism by European Americans began in Bellevue and in our region in the late 1800s. Aaron Mercer and William Meydenbauer are kind of known to be the ones who settle the land there. The largest convention center in East King County is actually named the Meydenbauer Center. Just a little bit more of the history here, because I think it's important for the conversation today, is within about 10 or 15 years of them arriving here in this area, a significant logging community was established and it was mostly Japanese immigrants who cleared the land. To attract tourism, one of our city's, Bellevue, initiated a strawberry festival created in the 1920s. It was very successful.Debbie Lacy:
However, in 1942, the festival was canceled because of the forced imprisonment of Japanese Americans during World War II. At that time, 90% of the agricultural workforce in our area was of Japanese ancestry, so the festival couldn't go on without them. It took 45 years to bring that festival back. So at the time, there was a very powerful businessman and politician named Miller Freeman who actually founded the Anti-Japanese League of Washington in the early 1900s. He was a lead advocate for anti-Japanese laws in our state.Debbie Lacy:
After the force removal of the Japanese Americans, many in the farming community lost the land that they owned or leased, which led to the development of the Bellevue downtown area, including Bellevue Square, which was built by Miller Freeman's family, so built on stolen land. And then of course, the multitude of anti Black policies and practices, there were racially restrictive covenants, Black and brown people weren't afforded even a place of rest because of area cemeteries that also enforced white-only policies.Debbie Lacy:
I talk about all of this because when we talk about belonging and placemaking and equity in our built environments, we have to start with the history, even the painful parts, especially the painful parts. Right now, East King County is an incredibly diverse area. We have, in many parts of our county, one out of three people are immigrants. Some of our cities are considered majority minority cities, although I don't like that term anymore. But we have a lot of people of color that live here in the suburbs of Seattle. We're actually more diverse racially and culturally than the city of Seattle is just because of the movement of many of our immigrant folks to the suburban communities.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Can you tell us about Eastside For All and your Build for Belong Initiative? What are some of the projects that you're working on?Debbie Lacy:
Eastside For All's Build for Belonging Initiative is about creating or expanding our third places, meaning places that aren't home or work or school, where people can gather with no agenda, informally, but where a lot of bridge building can be made informally. Some of the work that we do, for example, is right now involving the Eastrail Corridor. That's a really interesting project. The Eastrail is a 42-mile path, essentially, from south of us up through East King County, up to the Snohomish line, and it's built on a historic railroad line, actually. It'll be biking and pedestrian trails, sections of light rail, and it's going to be connecting employment centers, residential neighborhoods, and regional transit hubs and green space.Debbie Lacy:
Our Build for Belonging Initiative, at the beginning, was about bringing the frameworks to King County and the partners, the city partners that are all leading that effort, and helping them understand models of inclusion and equity when it comes to placemaking, and the ways in which we are advocating to work in communities, with communities, really taking and borrowing from some places and people that I'm inspired by.Debbie Lacy:
There was a MIT publication called Places in the Making. They talk about this virtuous cycle where it's a mutual relationship, communities transforming places, which in turn transformed communities. I really brought that and some other models forward, and they were very excited, very interested in this co-creation model, as opposed to more traditional forms of community engagement, which tend to be very top down, very limited. In the end, you still get kind of the same demographic of people participating in those conversations, as are the ones that hold the power in decision making.Debbie Lacy:
Anyway, they are very open, have been really interested in our ways of working with our community partners. We bring in community-based organizations and grassroots groups and have really pointed the leaders of this initiative to our local community leaders and said, "Hey, here are the people who have the connections, the trusted relationships with the very communities that you say you want to be involved in this project. Let's bring you all together. Let's make sure that those community groups are compensated for their expertise, the social capital that they're bringing, all of that wisdom and work that goes into this kind of an initiative. And let's make sure that we're, co-creating this together side by side."Debbie Lacy:
It's really exciting and we're going to be working together on a lot of things over the next couple of years, and hopefully beyond, because once the trail is fully built, there'll be lots of opportunities for community gathering spaces and programming events. But right now, we're excited about the annual Welcoming Week, which takes place in September, and we're going to be able to all get out there on the trail together in person, hopefully, and have a great event together.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Yeah, it's really great to hear that you're doing this work, because location and spaces do create opportunities for people to come together. Can you tell me more about who is leading the Eastrail Corridor project and the co-creation frame that is being used?Debbie Lacy:
The Eastrail Corridor project brings together key leadership from King County government itself, so staff, King County council members along with council members and mayors from our, from the cities that are involved, and that includes Renton, Bellevue, Kirkland, Redmond, and Woodenville, in addition, nonprofits and businesses, because it really is a cross sector effort that requires the connections with all these different groups, and including our environmental advocates, too.Debbie Lacy:
It's a really great cross section of many different sectors in our community that not only have a stake, but really live and work along this corridor, and so it's about bringing them all together. When I say they, I'm talking about the initial leadership that kind of brought everyone together. They don't necessarily, it wasn't an extremely diverse group racially or culturally, so they were lacking some of those perspectives we think, and really looking to partner with organizations like myself and other community-based groups to bring in that expertise and that lens of really connecting with our immigrant communities and our people of color.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Yeah. It's great that you're leading this work to bring the voices of people who would benefit from this into the conversation, because you're right, oftentimes these leaders just do the work in the way that they envision it not taking into account really with the community needs. I'm curious to learn a little bit more about why you started Eastside For All. It's a relatively new organization. Can you tell me what you were seeing in East King County that prompted you to create this group and why one of the main areas of focus is on belonging?Debbie Lacy:
This work evolved out of about two decades of work that I co-founded the Eastside Refugee and Immigrant Coalition in early 2002. And as you know, that was post 9/11. It was a really volatile time, a very difficult time for immigrants, particularly our Muslim neighbors. And so, we saw a real need to bring, at that time it was nonprofit providers, into conversations and actions that would really be much more aligned with our growing diverse community. Out of many sessions, meant many efforts and initiatives, and lots of partnerships, and I really have to emphasize that nothing I do or my organization does happens in a vacuum. We are very much connected and reliant upon some of our key community leaders here.Debbie Lacy:
We're continuing to come together, address gaps, address needs, but really what we saw in East King County, and I'm aware that this is a very familiar story across the country in been areas and smaller, especially rural communities, too, is that we're lacking the infrastructure. Right? There's not an immigrant refugee affairs office based in any of our cities. That's only in Seattle. That's the nearest one, which isn't that far, but it can be very far for people who are trying to navigate a new area and really want to be closer to home, right, to find the resources and communities that they need to survive and thrive. We didn't have that. None of our cities were racial equity initiatives. That was all happening with King County government, and again, the city of Seattle. So, lacking that infrastructure, we were constantly spinning our wheels. It's just we would get one step ahead and two steps back, and really not feeling that we were advancing equity at a systemic level.Debbie Lacy:
And so, around 2018, I just really was feeling that weight and the frustration and really asking myself big questions about what was the point of my work, anyway, if it just felt like Band-Aids and drops in the bucket? It was a moment of personal and professional a crisis for me, honestly. It was through that dark period where Eastside For All was born, again, out of these relationships, out of listening to community members, my friends and colleagues of color and all their experiences. It was created to help form the partnerships, public, and private and really work closely with our institutions, namely our city governments and our school districts, particularly those who had already set out to make a commitment for equity. And then we wanted to be able to give them the tools and resources to do that and the community connections, as well.Debbie Lacy:
And so, we see our selves as an advocate first and foremost, but also a convener, and sometimes an educator and a trainer. Right? But really, a place of working in between spaces, between institutions and community members, between different communities, and really trying to build those connections so that together we can do more than just Band-Aid solutions. That we can really through policy change and investment changes and ways of being, changing the way that we interact with one another, we can hopefully make systemic enduring changes that really can be benefit the entire community.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
It sounds like the points of tension that you were seeing that prompted you to create this organization and do the work has to do more between people and places, organization, or lack of infrastructures rather than between communities. Can you talk a little bit more about that?Debbie Lacy:
I would say it's actually all of that, really. There is tension between communities, between Black and brown and immigrant communities. We've had some really unfortunate things happen in our local cities, where there was a lot of anti inequity rhetoric and actions that were actually led by a small but powerful group of new immigrants. It was pitting some Asian Americans against our Black and Latino communities here. We have a large Muslim community, and they face a great deal of Islamophobia. Our Black population is relatively small, between like one in three in our Eastside cities, but they're experiencing great disparities and discrimination and persistent racism, and some of that comes from other people of color and other immigrants.Debbie Lacy:
We know that. It's a reality. It's a reality in our community. And again, I think Eastside For All, without trying to be Pollyanna about it, we are really wanting to create the spaces physically and through programming where people can come together, honestly face these realities with one another and the painful experiences of that, and ask now what question. How do we move past? How do we heal? How do we appropriately acknowledge first so that we can heal? And then what's before us? Where are the places of mutual interests, mutual benefit, shared vision that truly can unite us, if not across all topics and all ways, but in certain specific ways that could make really positive lasting changes.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
I do think that a lot of the fear and a lot of the negative perceptions that people have of different communities have to do with the fact that there are little opportunities for people to interact with one another. We get all this information from political leaders who sort of pin us up against each other and start to brew these tensions. I like the way that you're approaching this by creating opportunities, for people to come together, for people to come in intentional spaces, were physically and have also a program created for people to come together and interact and get to know each other, and hopefully begin to dispel those stereotypes that we have of one another.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
You showed me a survey report for the city of Kirkland, which is located in East King County. Even though the majority of community members felt safe, a lot of Latinos felt forgotten. Some identify gaps in bilingual services and express the need to travel to other cities to get services in Spanish. Others felt like there were no Latino community in Kirkland, or maybe there weren't enough public spaces where people were able to form this community. Is this a pattern in other areas of East King County?Debbie Lacy:
Absolutely. I think we're not alone in that. Again, I think a lot of suburban cities, especially smaller ones and rural areas, can certainly have this same thing happening, where predominantly white community members have built the cities that now exist the buildings around us, and then as we diversify, there hasn't been that intentional plan to say, "Hey, let's look around and take and take an assessment of the physical spaces that we have, the community-gathering spaces, and what we're doing as a community to intentionally build community." Not just within individual communities, because I think that's necessary. That project was launched by the city of Kirkland in partnership with the Promotores Network, which was really about listening to Latino community members in that particular city of Kirkland. That's what they said over and over.Debbie Lacy:
They would say, "We didn't even know that there were other Latino families here." They would say, if they were asked a question about the Latino community in Kirkland, "They would say what Latino community in Kirkland?" That's not just because we don't have a Latino community center, but it's partly that. I think that both are lacking. When I say both, I mean, individual cultures and community's spaces: Latino, Muslim, Black, indigenous, Asian. People need their places. People need to find their people. That's super important. And the places and spaces where people can come together with that intentional spirit of let's build community across with other people from other backgrounds. I do think it is something that is a challenge, a gap, no matter what city we're talking about in our area, and it's something that I'm deeply committed to making a dent in.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
You've mentioned a few times this idea of creating cross-cultural facilities and gathering spaces for people to come together with communities that are similar to them or also to bridge across communities. You said that there's one being explored in the city of Bellevue. I'd like to talk a little bit more about this project. I know that this is still in the early stages, but can you describe how this idea was developed?Debbie Lacy:
Yes, Bellevue is the largest city in our East King County area, and it's one of the largest cities in the state of Washington, in fact. It's extremely diverse. It was the first in our area to become one of those, quote-unquote, majority minority cities a few years back. And so, this initiative for a cultural center across cultural center goes way back, nearly 30 years now out. It was in a cultural diversity community action plan and then it was in several other policy documents, but it was never really fully actualized or it didn't even really get launched past the idea stage. But then in 2014, Bellevue created its diversity advantage plan, and that outlined a number of recommended actions for the city to pursue its equity and inclusion initiatives. One of them was to convene a community advisory group to explore the establishment of what was called there, a Bellevue Diversity Institute.Debbie Lacy:
It was intended to be an experiential learning center that would serve as a citywide cultural center, a resource for businesses, schools, community groups, et cetera, and its mission would be to educate, celebrate, challenge, and inspire Bellevue to be a welcoming and inclusive of community that embraces diversity. So, while the Diversity Institute terminology has been dropped as a name, the concept remains, and Bellevue invested in a multi-phase study and community outreach process. From that study's key findings, in addition to more programming and more art venues, there was expressed strong interest and enthusiasm for a branded and identified cross-cultural center in Bellevue, separate from existing community centers. Bellevue as a city has the opportunity to physically build something that honors community input and truly advances its commitments, right, to equity and inclusion, in ways that current community centers and programming alone can't fulfill.Debbie Lacy:
The idea is more about intercultural or cross-cultural as opposed to multicultural. I think it's just an exciting place that we're in to be having this conversation to having had the investments made in process. We truly hope with the support of a great multicultural multiracial group that's come together called the Friends of Bellevue Cross Cultural Center, we really hope that the city will continue partnering with this group and really listening and being responsive to this vision that is new and unique. It very rare to find in the United States an actual intercultural space like this, what we are imagining.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Yeah, that sounds beautiful. I wish I had something like that growing up. I want to talk a little bit about the co-creation process that you've mentioned that you're bringing to people who are leading these projects to ensure that everyone's voices are created, or are heard, rather, and also this idea that through the process of co-creating something, it also supports belonging. It's not just the endpoint, once this place is physically done, that's going to create belonging, but the idea that if you're bringing community members into this process, being involved in the cause itself has great opportunities to create belonging within the community. Can you talk about how you'd like to see this take place and what will it require of the city and broader community?Debbie Lacy:
The request is not easy, what we're asking, because it's new, is challenging sometimes to even communicate or articulate this way of doing things, when our institutions, our leaders, are really so used to doing it a totally different way, and it is a way that unfortunately has perpetuated the status quo, IE, practices and actual physical spaces that really not only don't take advantage of an opportunity to invite broadly and welcome broadly et cetera, but in some cases are not unwelcoming, not safe for people. And of course, that's a negative unintentional outcome. But I just think the first step is really about an openness to new ways of doing things. So, we're asking, we're inviting the city in the leadership and community to be in the chaotic space for a bit, to be patient when you extend an invitation, that's truly meant to be inclusive and people actually show up because they care and they're excited about something, it can be difficult. You've got lots of voices or lots of cooks in the kitchen, so to speak. Right?Debbie Lacy:
What I want people to remember or know is that that's not the end result. That's just part of the process. It's a natural part of the process. That doesn't mean that the whole thing is a huge amount of chaos from beginning to end. It's just a natural phase that any diverse group of people have to go through in order to get to the clarity, in order to get to something that everybody can really feel good about. The process of doing that so important, that we can be in a space together and we can say, "Oh, wow, look at all the different opinions about how this building should look or what should happen in this building. This is really hard."Debbie Lacy:
And we can say, "And now what?" You know, what is it that we want to offer back to ourselves, our community, our youth, future generations? What can we make together, and what are the compromises, but also what are the innovations that can come out that really honor our individual histories, our collective history, and the way forward? I think what we're asking for is in some ways a suspension of what we have known, and certainly a risk, but one that's meant to truly inspire. And just like you were saying, it really isn't just about any one project, the process itself, of doing it this way, of deeply listening to communities who have historically been marginalized, disenfranchised, opening the doors, where instead of just inviting them to the table, you're asking them to help build the table a lot alongside so many others, this is about claiming our power as community.Debbie Lacy:
This is about saying, "We matter, we do have a voice. We may not have the millions and billions of dollars required to build all the things that we would like, but we have voice and power in community and we have lots of resources and riches that we can bring to bear in the conversation and that should be honored and respected, because we're here too. We're contributing to this community and making it great." There's so much that can come out of that, that is not just about in the end having a great space where people do great things, but think about the civic leadership. Think about diverse representation. Think about all the ways that new projects will kind of be borne from that experience of coming together in that way,Miriam Magaña Lopez:
You're inviting community members to come in and voice their opinions and make an impact on the way that this cross-cultural center would be invited, or rather would be designed. I think that there might be some listeners who are interested in applying this framework and work that they're doing, because you are right. In many places, oftentimes, city officials have limited time, limited budget to do a project, and it's often easier to just get it done internally without bringing community members in, because it does add more time, it adds more messiness, and like you mentioned, it's not just because it's bringing community members in, but because it's bringing more people to the table. With any project that you do, there's more people on the table, there's more ideas and more perspectives that need to be taken into account. How are city officials taking this feedback?Debbie Lacy:
I would say that we are being heard. Really, we are being heard. No final decisions have been made where there's some tentative aspects of this that we hope it resolved soon so that we can just continue moving forward. But the main thing is that the conversation is happening. City leadership, they're listening. They're asking us really good questions. Some are tough questions. Right? Things that we don't have answers for yet or may never know for sure, that we can't anticipate, obviously. But there's a lot of conversations happening that are key. I think what's been helpful is to bring in a wide range of people, constituents, stakeholders. That matters to our leaders. They truly want to be responsive to the community. So, it wouldn't be nearly as successful if it were just me having a conversation, or one of my other colleagues. It's not just the powers and numbers. It's the diverse city of stakeholders.Debbie Lacy:
And so, we really did a good thing by starting our Build for Belonging Initiative with a series of events and conversations, where we're bringing models forward from other parts of the country, other parts of the world, to say, "Here's what's possible. Why can't can't we do this? Why can't Bellevue do this? Kirkland, Redmond? What's holding us back? What is the way forward together in our communities?" And so, asking those kind of questions, presenting people with the information that they need to begin exploring, and starting with relationships, not making it an agonistic battle, but more of an invitation. We're inviting each other in to explore something new together. We don't have all the answers. No one here is the expert in this, but we all bring an expertise that's important. That has to be respected and honored, so how do we get to know each other?Debbie Lacy:
Let's first talk about our concerns and hopes and put the agenda aside for a moment and then come back to what it is what we're co-creating. So again, I think it's about education, awareness, relationships, and really bringing in all the different parts of the community that you can possibly get to come together in the conversation because it's harder to ignore that. Then when you get people talking together and get really excited, that's what moves people and places in communities.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Thank you so much for outlining that. And it's does seem like it's a lot of extra work, but it seems like the benefits outweigh all of the additional effort. I really hope that our listeners get to hear your story and get inspired, whether hopefully the city council in whatever city is bringing these ideas, but if not, commuting members also have the power to bring these ideas to city leadership to make sure that they are really listening to the people who are living in the community, and like you said, inviting to try something different. Even if the solution isn't there, the process itself, even if the outcome takes a little bit longer, can be just as powerful. It seems like as of now, the cross-cultural center is a north star that you're working towards, but I wonder, and you've mentioned sort of how you imagined the process would be and kind of what it would look like, but I want to take a step back. How do you want a community member to feel when they walk into this space?Debbie Lacy:
That's such a great question. I would love for people to feel, first of all, welcomed, safe, and inspired. When they look around, I want them to see parts of themselves, but also parts of other people and communities and cultures that they may not know yet. And so, it becomes eyeopening, an eyeopening experience for them. But most of all, just a place to come and be themselves, and get to know neighbors, and feel that there's a place there where they can be heard and seen.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Thank you. That sounds beautiful. I know that in many communities, those spaces aren't available, and the fact that you're working to try to create that in your community is really powerful. I've been having conversations with other people who are also doing bridging work. Some people are doing it more between individuals or between communities. You're doing it through structural change. You want to change the physical space of your community to promote belonging. Most admit that it's really tough work, not just the amount of effort and time required, but it's also an emotional process. It requires a lot of effort from organizers and participants, and sometimes things don't go as planned. It's not always linear. I wonder if you've come up with a few lessons as you continue to move forward with incorporating belonging into your work.Debbie Lacy:
Well, first of all, thank you for that. That was very affirming. I'm nodding my head to everything you were saying there. Lessons? Wow. I really think having friends, true friends in this work is really, really helpful. We need our people that we can vent to and share our successes and our failures with together, and that's so important, I would say, especially for people of color in a community that has tended to be very more white dominant and historically not as welcoming, not welcoming to people of color. That's key. And then, like I said before, being able to make relationships outside of our own cultural and ethnic and racial groups, and really get to know people, what makes them tick, what keeps them up at night, what they want their hopes for themselves, for their children and grandchildren.Debbie Lacy:
And also trying to find those places of connection for various sectors, because as a nonprofit provider and a community advocate, I can get very narrowly focused on my, quote-unquote, people who do the same kind of things. And we absolutely can't do this alone. Right? We need environmental advocates. We need the business community. We need city government leadership. We need schools and educators. It really is about all of us. And so, the lessons I've learned are about if we do not take the time to get to know each other, and again, put the agendas aside so that we can start with the people and what, who they actually are, and what they want, and what their dreams are for the future, then if we don't take time for that, we will forever be playing catch up. Something will always be missing, something will always be off, and we have to do that.Debbie Lacy:
It's hard. Like you said, it does take time. It's something that we can't always measure the way people want us to track metrics and have the linear cause and effect, and then we had this great impact and outcome. It's not like that. It's about human beings in communities. And we have to allow for that. We have to build that into the process, acknowledge it as part of what's required, and really hold it and support it for as long as it takes, sometimes doing that before we even get to the idea stage or the design stage. It's very critical that we can have that as a foundation with each other and for ourselves.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Thank you so much for mentioning that. And it actually it reminds me, I interviewed another group called the Wind and the Warrior, and they mentioned a similar sentiment. They said, "Some fights you can just show up for, but for the long-term fights, if you don't build relationship time, your fight is going to fall apart." It's such an important and instrumental step and it's really important for people who are listening to take that into account, because you're right. Sometimes funders, they just want you to see the end product, and you have to work within a timeline, and that timeline doesn't allow for that relationship building.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
And so, in doing this belonging work, you're not only dealing with the hiccups that come with bringing so many people into the table, but also with indicators that you have to track to continue to get the funding to do the work that you're doing. It's sort of an ongoing process, and I really hope that funders start to begin to realize that this phase, this relationship phase building, is super important for these long term fights that have a greater long-term impact rather than just finishing it and being done. When we begin to form relationships and begin to build trust with one another, that's when real change will happen.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
What advice would you give to people who are embarking type of work for the first time?Debbie Lacy:
I would have people first start with the things that they're most passionate about. I think you even said early on, "I wish I had had a place like that when I was growing up." What would we have wanted for ourselves? What do we want for our children, right, and to begin having that close relationship with our own needs and aspirations, and then finding others who share that dream, not necessarily the specifics, but again, being in relationship with others who can that with you. And while I think some of the core values are necessary to share in common, having an open-mindedness about the ways in which those values come about. Right?Debbie Lacy:
It requires a sense of putting aside of one's self, and sometimes our individual needs and preferences and being in community. I think if we focus in on that, I know that's kind of not necessarily a very concrete piece of advice to give someone, but I really do believe that if people can take that time to learn that about themselves and then reach out in that same spirit of curiosity with others around them who do not necessarily look the same as them or may not have the exact same all beliefs, but the power of that, beginning with that, ends up taking you in places that you wouldn't have come to if you had set out with a very clear agenda and idea about what you wanted to build or create. I really would say begin with that sense of curiosity and the connecting spaces.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Thank you. I think that's super important for all of us to acknowledge the responsibility that we have to have in ourselves in this work. It's not just about showing up, but it's also about doing the internal work of deciding how we show up, and if we show up with our own ideas or we show up with an openness to hear other people's ideas. We don't necessarily have to agree on everything, but are we willing to listen and view people's perspectives in a different way?Miriam Magaña Lopez:
I really appreciate, Debbie, your time sharing with me everything that you're doing in East King County. It sounds like you're moving forward and doing a lot of amazing work that, like you mentioned, it's years in the making, but once you're there, it's going to have great outcomes for your community. I wonder if we can end with you telling us what is the future that you envision for your community of East King County?Debbie Lacy:
Well, the big picture of course is about racial justice, equitable access, safe and thriving communities, all of that. But I think the heart of that is about a community where invitations are extended, compassion is practiced, and where we move beyond merely the practice of these ideals in interpersonal exchanges, but where inclusion and equity are baked in, institutionalized, built into our policies, our protocols, our physical buildings, and our ways of being with one another. I truly hope that future generations will benefit from a new way of relating to each other, to people who are different from them, and relating to their own physical built spaces around them, the earth. We owe it to them to build this now where we can and how we can.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
That was Debbie Lacy. Thank you for your time. And to our listeners, please check out our other podcasts where we discuss belonging and bridging in more detail. For more resources and curriculums on belonging and bridging, please go to belonging.berkeley.edu/b4b. That is slash letter B, number four, letter B. To follow Debbie's work, go to eastsideforall.org.Miriam Magaña Lopez:
Until next time.
